RE: Subframe drop to reduce torque-steer - 164 - long

["Doug Gould" <dgould@domain.elided>]

Brad

I had been wondering why this "mod" hadn't been mentioned by you or Colin or
Dave or Alfa Bill. There is some possibility that there is a difference
between US and European models that comes into play as well.

My understanding (which is not perfect) goes like this:
the original 164 manual and auto models were identical (89 - 90-ish)
The 164Q had a different steering rack and the dropped cross member
In late 1992 the steering rack and subframe mods were extended to the auto
version as well
The 164 Super has this later arrangemrent.

These changes may have also included a changed sump shape and exhaust
layout - I haven't checked this in enough detail.

All of this chronology is blurred by Alfa's laid back attitude to model-year
features. My last 164 was built in 1989 according to the chassis no., it had
a July 90 build sticker and a 1991 Australian compliance plate! Mt current
164 was built in 1990 according to the chassis number and has a Jan 90 bulid
sticker and a 1990 Australian compliance plate. However my blue 164 has the
interior upgrade that is regarded as having been available in Australia with
the 1992 upgrade. Folklore says that only 16 true 1992 model year 164's were
sold in Australia. I have had a close look at two Australian delivered 1992
MY 164's and one Hong Kong delivered 1992 MY 164. Each of these cars had
both the different rack and dropped subframe.(They also had the same
interior as my new blue 90 model - incidently the paint references in the
164 homepage indicate that my blue colour was not available until 1992
either!) I looked at three 164 Supers (seconhand imports from Hong Kong) and
these all had this subframe arrangement.

I haven't yet had a close think about the geometery, but the folklore says
that lowering the subframe makes the driveshafts closer to parallel, which
reduces torque steer. I have some suspicion that it may also involve some
more complex geometery associated with the swing arc of the lower control
arms and / or the steering arms.

Whatever the weather, the dropped subframe can be identified by examining
the relative height of the plenum chamber to the dog bone mount near the
strut top. On the earlier version the plenum chamber is nearly level with
the pressed steel mount. In dropped subframe version the plenum chamber is
about 1/2 inch lower, which is readily visible to the eye.

Underneath the car (applies to 164 super as well) you can plainly see some
spacers between the subframe and body. They are quite plain oval shaped
steel spacers. When I was inspecting 164's to buy, I would just reach under
the front and feel for a gap between subframe and body that I could fit my
finger in.

Thats about as much as I can tell you. My mechanic (Hugh Harrison in
Melbourne) has a pattern for the spacers. I'll get his email if you want
more detail. I have copied this reply to the digest to see if we get some
more comment.Putting in the spacers loses a little ground clearance, but I
have gained a bit anyway by installing Bilstein's. We live on a dirt road
where ground clearance is of more importance than those living in the
suburbs.

Doug Gould
90 164L

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