Re: Weak jack points, & 116 structure generally

[JHertzman@domain.elided]

In AD7-744 David Johnson replies, as Sebastian had in 743, to the question 
Andrew had asked in 738 about weak jack points and, more generally, 
structural rust in a GTV-6. It is a complicated question, with different 
answers according to the extent of the rust and desired longevity of the car; 
a restoration project, like David's, take a different answer than a 
keep-the-beater-running-a-while-longer car would take. And the answers should 
be about the same, with detail differences, for all of the 116 cars, whether 
Alfetta, Milano, GTV-6, 90, or Giulietta Nuova.

While the 105/115 has a substantial cross-member carrying the front 
suspension, the 116 does not; it has two boxed members running from the front 
to the rear anchor-points of the torsion bars. The skirts (or engine 
compartment sides) are tangent to these, running up to the joint with the 
fender - bolted on some, spot-welded on others. (On the cars with bolted-on 
fenders there is a boxing member running along the top of the skirt from the 
front bulkhead to the firewall.) On each side of the engine bay there is a 
hat-section spot welded to the skirt, accepting the upper suspension loadings 
and distributing them into the skirt and the skirt-fender joint. There is yet 
another hat-section (derby, this time - rounded rather than squared-) running 
diagonally from the lower suspension to the upper end of the doorpost where 
the windshield posts, firewall, and skirt all come together. With the lower 
members tied into the middle of the floor and this "derby" triangulating the 
lower member and the skirt to the base of the windshield one can lose quite a 
bit of the structure around the jacking-point/sill/doorpost juncture without 
the car getting too loose. It is less critical than, say, the anchorage at 
the front end of the rear radius rods on a Giulietta.

A reasonably prudent course, for someone who isn't planning on keeping the 
car forever and who isn't sure how bad the rust is, would be to not use the 
jacking points; buy a scissors jack and jack the car from the suspension. 
(One may want to carry a short length of 4x6 to drive a flat up onto.) The 
scissors jack isn't too bad an idea even on an all-out complete repair.

For someone (like David) who wants to do it right for the long-term, the 
first order of business is to pull the "vertical arch closure panels" which 
David mentioned, behind the wheels. These are intended to keep mud, slush, 
salt etcetera out of some vulnerable areas but also perversely trap the mud 
and salty slush and keep it from drying out (or from being washed out by a 
careful owner). The other place which does a wonderful job of keeping a moist 
cake of salty dirt is the joint between the skirt and the fender. Pull the 
removable panels, wash vigorously, sandblast, weep, and carefully plan the 
replacement of lost metal. As with the 105/115 cars, a parts book is 
extremely useful as an aid in understanding the structure. 

David's choice - learning the trades, and doing it yourself - is commendable. 
Restoration bodywork is expensive, and collision-repair shops are really in a 
different line of business. Unless the bodyman is VERY conscientious, it is 
easy for him to cut corners after he finds that he underestimated the work 
and is going to lose money on the job. 

Good luck, all-

John H.
Raleigh, N.C.

------------------------------