Re: [ihc] Re: making a 1/2T a 3/4T

["Dennis Bernth" <scoutdude@xxxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

  Thanks Mac, I will defer to you on this one. I never heard of a military
3/4 ton pickup, but I guess they exist, and with the Dana 44 front. But, as
you said, they use the 'normal' front end with locking hubs. My money is
still on those fronts Ryan is talking about being from Dodge military
pickups. Do the military 3/4 tons use the same drivetrain as the CUCV
(6.2/TH400/NP208)?
  Dennis
  ----- Original Message -----
  From: "Mac McMuffin" <mac@domain.elided>
  To: "Dennis Bernth" <scoutdude@domain.elided>; <baradium@domain.elided>;
<ihc@domain.elided>
  Sent: Thursday, March 25, 2004 12:22 PM
  Subject: RE: [ihc] Re: making a 1/2T a 3/4T


  > ## >>   IF there are 3/4 ton Chevy pickups in the military, they're
probably
  > ## >> locally sourced or gotten from GSA and are not mil-spec.
  > ## >> There was a half
  > ## >> ton Chevy 4x4 on Ebay a while back that was supposedly bought
  > ## >> from a DRMO
  > ## >> auction; it was painted up like a CUCV, but was half ton
  > ## >> civilian all the
  > ## >> way. I would guess that local bases have some leeway when they
need a
  > ## >> utility vehicle to requistion one from GSA, who probably had
  > ## >> a lot full of
  > ## >> Chevy 4x4's that they had bought for the USFWS, Forest
  > ## >> Service, National
  > ## >> Parks, etc.
  >
  > when i saw this message, i decided to go do a little research.  here on
Fort
  > Bliss, a couple units still have some old GM trucks in their motorpools.
  > not many, but a few.  i went down to the biggest one and asked them
about
  > it.  there are *no* 1.25ton CUCV GM trucks left in service on this post.
  > not even one.  they were all excessed after the first Gulf War, the last
one
  > auctioned off last year sometime.  however, that particular motorpool
has 18
  > of the 3/4ton 4x4 pickups, and another unit here has half a dozen (this
  > doesn't count the National Guard and Reserves, who still have the CUCV
as
  > well as 3/4ton pickups).  this morning i asked about that, about how
they
  > got them.  they're all military issue, there was no "leeway when they
needed
  > a utility vehicle", they were not requisitioned from the GSA.  each of
these
  > trucks was ordered specifically for the United States Army.  none of
them is
  > in current active service per se, they're all basically waiting quietly
to
  > be excessed, though they are still maintained and kept in an active
service
  > motorpool lot.  they were used in the first Gulf War, but not in the
second.
  >
  > additionally, there are two 3/4ton military Suburbans here on post, but
i
  > couldn't find the motorpool they belong to.  they had another one, but a
  > couple idiots rolled it in Saudi Arabia last year.  one guy was killed
and
  > two injured in that fiasco.
  >
  > lastly, we have exactly *one* military 4x4 Blazer on this post.  it's
kept
  > in the motorpool right across the lot from the motorpool that has the 18
  > 3/4ton pickups.  i'm told the post used to have more, but apparently
they've
  > all been excessed.  that one is the only one left, and i don't know why
they
  > still have it.
  >
  > i took pictures of the 3/4ton 4x4 pickups and the Blazer.  as i said, i
  > couldn't find the motorpool where the Suburbans are kept (more
accurately,
  > that part of the post is blocked off right now).  but i did get 21
pictures
  > of the 3/4ton trucks and 2 of the Blazer.  these trucks are all mid-'80s
or
  > so, i believe.  the pictures are attached, but i bet only Dennis and
Ryan
  > get them.  you can also see in one of the pictures, #17, what they
replaced
  > the CUCV and 3/4ton trucks with--a 4x2 Chevy single rear wheel flatbed
with
  > stakesides.  the post is crawling with those.  when i was in South
Carolina,
  > Fort Jackson had mostly 4x2 Dodge diesel 3500 flatbeds with stake sides.
i
  > haven't seen any of those here that aren't civilian-owned, apparently
this
  > post got all GM products.
  >
  > ## >>   The guy with the axles either doesn't know what he has or
  > ## >> what they came
  > ## >> from, or they're not what he says they are. AFAIK, any Dana
  > ## >> 44 front used by
  > ## >> GM would have lockouts, or lockouts could be installed. I'm
  > ## >> not sure what GM
  > ## >> used for front axles post-1988, but I don't think they're HD
  > ## >> 44's- IIRC,
  > ## >> they're a coil sprung, independent suspension type, nothing
  > ## >> like a 'normal'
  > ## >> 44 you could use under a Travelall.
  >
  > i believe this is essentially correct.  of course, by the time GM went
with
  > the independent suspension front axle, the military (or at least the
Army)
  > had stopped buying anything but HMMWVs for their 4x4 applications.  all
of
  > the non-HHWV/non-(older)CUCV GM trucks are flatbed stakeside 4x2 trucks.
we
  > have CUCV HMMWVs, plus about fifty other variants of the HMMWV, but
that's
  > all.  we don't have anything in 4x4 here that isn't either a HMMWV or
one of
  > the older 3/4ton GM trucks mentioned previously.  none of the new
  > general-purpose utility trucks are 4x4.
  >
  > ## >> The 'ONLY' front 44's
  > ## >> that I know of
  > ## >> that don't have normal hubs that can take locking hubs are
  > ## >> the morphodite
  > ## >> Dodges. Even when Dodge went to front axle disconnects in the
  > ## >> mid-80's, it
  > ## >> kept the same outer hub style, just used a chrome 'cover' on
  > ## >> the outside to
  > ## >> replace the locking hub assembly since the lock in, lock out
  > ## >> function was
  > ## >> done by the axle disconnect. I also don't think GM used front
  > ## >> 44's after
  > ## >> about 1977- they went to their own 10 bolt, which uses most
  > ## >> of the same
  > ## >> suspension parts (ball joints, locking hubs, etc) as the earlier
44's.
  >
  > as i mentioned above, the trucks we have here are mid-'80s trucks.  as
best
  > i can tell, they have Dana 44 front axles (or GM 12-bolts).  i could not
get
  > a good angle for the rear axles, so i don't know what those are.  the
fronts
  > are D44 (or GM 12-bolt), though.  if you look in a couple of the
close-ups,
  > you can see the angular case and cover plate, unlike the more rounded
cover
  > plate and round housing found on both of the 10-bolt GM axles.
  >
  > all of the axles i could see had those big hubs with lockouts, even the
  > Blazer.  they sure stick out a bit, don't they?
  >
  > usual nickel and grain of salt disclaimer applies.
  >
  > --Mac
  >
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  >
  > Krystof "Mac" MacBryghde
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  >
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