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Hawk Blues, Y-5's,and other race pads

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David Kroth writes....

From: "David J. Kroth x65799" <kroth@domain.elided>
Date: Thu, 29 Aug 1996 09:52:49 -0400
Subject: Hawk Blue brake pad ramblings

A few weeks/months ago Carl Buckland sang the praises of Hawk Blue brake
pads for use at the track.  Since I found myself burning up a set of
MetalMasters every track weekend, I figured I'd give the Blues a try
to see if I could save some money and increase braking efficiency.

Here's what I found (which tends to confirm what Carl posted):

  - The work REAL good when hot.  They never fade and when you press the
    pedal its like "throwing out the anchor".  My braking zones got shorter
    by about 20% (vs. MetalMaster).

  - Dust is greatly reduced.  No kidding.  One of the experts commented
    that with Hawks, the dust you do see is actually rotor dust.  I was
    concerned about rotor wear, so I measured the rotors with a micrometer.
    After about 230 track miles, the RF rotor lost about 0.006" and the
    LF decreased by just over 0.003".  Someone else heard I was using Hawk
    Blues and said, "Hawks will eat your rotors.  Use Cool Carbons."  Several
    thoughs flashed through my head: Bon-Ami, Zymol, GOOD-TIMES...

  - They are loud - in more ways than one.  On the track, they make a course
    grinding/scraping noise when applied.  If your're just loping around
    the pits you can hear the rish-rish-rish as the pads rest loosly next
    to the rotors.  If you drive them cold around town they will squeel
    a lot.  No, its more than that.  It actually sounds like a pen full of
    stuck pigs tied up under the wheelwells.  I attracted a lot of attention
    in town when I went to buy gas.

  - From the looks of the pads I will guess that I will be able to get at
    least four more track days out of them.  That makes them slightly more
    economical than Metalmasters plus I get the increased performance.

  - Additional bonus: I got to talk with TC Kline and Randy Pobst on the
    phone.



- - -- 
Dave
kroth@domain.elided

xxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxxx

Dear David and all,

Thanks for trying the Hawks, and then sharing your experiences.

I have come to a conclusion about ALL race pads (and I am refering to 
full race, track pads)....they are ALL  noisy, dirty (some more than 
others), and , most important of all

    ALL RACE PADS MUST BE WARM BEFORE USING
                                   and
   AFTER USING RACE PADS, LET THE ROTORS COOL NATURALLY

I used to think  "Hawks are kind to rotors, Performance Friction or 
Porterfield R-4's are hard on rotors."  There "may" be some variance 
from one race pad to another in rotor wear, but the truth is, if you 
use them very gingerly before really slamming on the binders, you will 
reduce your rotor wear dramatically.  Dig this...when I first got my 
Porterfields, last year, I "broke them in" by leaving the shop and
driving up and down the boulevard, slamming on the brakes.  Needless 
to say, I ruined my rotors in short order.  I DO believe that Hawk 
pads are the best for most of us, driving street cars in driving 
schools and club races, and that they ARE less abrasive than 
Porterfields.  But, the general rule still applies:

the key is to always warm the pads and rotors gradually before using 
them hard, and then cool them gradually after hard use.  Moreover, 
even during a track session, try to cool off your brakes every few 
laps, or even within a lap, whenever you possibly can.

On a slightly different topic....Hawk Y-5 pads are a very specialized 
pad, and should be used for autocrossing ONLY.  They are designed to 
stop with a fair amount of pedal pressure (as apposed to "soft 
touch"), and to stop like a brick wall when so applied.  In other 
words, you can modulate your pedal (it doesn't just have an on-off 
swith), from "slightly slowing down," to "throwing out the proverbial 
anchor."   The Y-5 is a very soft pad, and is , therefore, very 
dirty, and very noisy.  They do not have a centering clip (most race 
pads don't), and they can rattle like a spoiled baby.  This problem 
can be fixed --I will post a recent letter from Bob Tunnell, me, John 
Broderik, etc that addresses this problem--but is very annoying 
unless it is addressed.

Further, the Y-5 works very well COLD, which is a must in 
autocrossing, where the pads seldom have a chance to heat up.  They 
do NOT, however, handle heat well at all.  I recently used them in 
the Solo Time Trials Nationals, and found out the hard way that they 
are NOT a road racing pad (solo time trials are a combination of 
autocross and road racing.  Up to 95 mph, and some very severe 
braking is required).  After only a couple of laps, they just didn't 
work, and they made the rotors shudder, just like when the rotors are 
warped.  As it ended up, the rotors are not warped, and after the 
rotors and pads cooled off, the shudder went away.  In fact, I had a 
chance to show Carl Stewart (TC Kline's right hand man, who was in 
Salt Lake for an atheletic event.  Cool guy with lots of BMW 
knowledge) first hand what I am talking about.  We ran the M3 up to a 
good head of steam, and then I STOOD on the brakes.  As is the Y-5's 
habit, the car stopped, right now!  One more time, same thing.  Third 
time, big time shudders.  I pulled over, and the rotors were 
absolutely blue hot, and continued to shudder for several miles.  I 
layed off of them for a while, and soon they were fine again.

The Y-5 is not a street pad.  They do require a lot of pedal 
preassure to fully stop the car, they are dirty, and they are noisy.  
If you need an autocross pad, however, give them a try.  They are the 
acknowledged leader in this nitch market.

Street pads are another subject for another day.  PBR Deluxes are my 
choice , but many want an "all purpose" pad.  "Domzi" will tell you 
to try Performance Friction Z-Rated pads.   Carl Stewart at TC Kline
reccommends the Hawk HPS (which I plan to try as soon as I get around 
to ordering some).  There are others, which I am sure fellow readers 
will tell us about.

Stopping is half the fun,

Carl

I will post the article on "Brake Squeal" in just a few minutes


Carl Buckland
1000 Boston Bldg
Nine Exchange Place
Salt Lake City, Utah  84111
801-531-6686
Fax 531-6690
E Mail buckland@domain.elided