Re: Spider roll bars

["George Schweikle" <schweikg@xxxxxxxxxxxxx>]

Digesti,

I got way behind in digests, and am just catching up. Apoligies if the
Spider roll bar dialog has already dealt with this issue:
The autopower Race roll bar from IOPort and others has been revised to a
wider width and it can't be used in a street Spider; the entire top
mechanism must be removed for clearance. I have been in touch with IOPort,
regarding this, and they were very helpfull in resolving this issue. But I
now must fabricate a track legal bar to update the old bar in my Spider.

Brian Shorey has a nice website illustrating a removable installation of an
older style Autopower race in his track / street Spider. Russ Neeley also
used one while disconnecting some mechanism joints to erect the top over the
taller bar.

Does anyone have an old style Autopower race bar for sale?

George Schweikle
Lexington, KY

>      Spider Roll Bars
> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 07:11:53 -0500
> From: Dana Loomis <dloomis@domain.elided>
> Subject: re: Spider roll bar
>
> Paul Misencik wrote:
> >If I'm going to run with the Mid-Atlantic Chapter and the BMWCCA and so
forth,
> >am I correct in assuming that the "street" roll bar sold by IAP and
others is
> >not acceptable?
>
> Thanks to Paul for asking this question.  Yes--those "street" bars are
> unacceptable.  And you can consider this an authoritative answer, because
> I'm chairman of Mid-Atlantic's track events program.
>
> There are three main points to consider in selecting or building a roll
> bar: the main hoop must extend the full width of the car, it must have a
> diagonal brace, and two rear braces, and there must be at least 1"
> clearance between the top of the driver's helmet and a line from the top
of
> the main hoop to the windshield (or the front hoop, if it's a full cage).
> Bolt-in bars are acceptable and the diagonal can be removable, however.
> Further details can be found at www.midatlanticaroc.org in the Driving
> Schools section.
>
> >Do I have to get one of the SCCA-approved "race" bars from IO
> >Port Racing or some other source?
>
> Not necessarily.  First we need to be clear that there is no such thing as
> an SCCA-legal rollbar for wheel-to-wheel racing: SCCA has required a full
> cage for some time.  The kind of roll bar you want is one that meets the
> standards for Solo I (time trials, hill climbs and the like).   Several
> manufacturers sell them ready made, or you can have one built locally to
> your personal specifications.  This might be a good option for you,
because
> there is someone in every North Carolina town who builds race cars.  The
> NASCAR and circle track boys do good work at honest prices.
>
> >If so, will this bar interfere with the operation of the soft top in any
> appreciable way?
>
> Yes, but there are workarounds.  Someone who owns a spider will explain.
>
> ------------------------------
>
> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 07:33:07 -0500
> From: Dana Loomis <dloomis@domain.elided>
> Subject: More on roll bars
>
> Russ Neely wrote:
> >The "street" roll bar is totally inadequate unless you are really
> >short.  The "street" bar comes up to about my ears and it lacks diagonal
> >cross bracing.
>
> A female member of this list once pointed out that a lot of
> people--including most women--are "really short" by Russ's standards.
> Technically, a less tall driver can meet the 1" clearance requirement by
> with a lower roll bar, which may not interfere with the convertible top.
> Mounting the driver's seat closer to the floor or using a thinner racing
> seat can also help get the required clearance.  The ornamental "street"
> bars still lack the required cross-bracing, however.
>
> An additional consideration for cars used in driving schools is that, at
> least in theory, the instructor in the right-hand seat should have as much
> protection as the driver.  We currently don't check helmet clearance  for
> the right-seat passenger, but probably should.
>
> Dana Loomis
> Mid-Atlantic Alfa Romeo Club
>
>
>
> Date: Tue, 18 Feb 2003 10:31:39 -0500
> From: "Bain, Bill" <Bill.Bain@domain.elided>
> Subject: Spider Roll Bars
>
> There's a pretty significant amount of "engineering" required to mount a
> roll bar properly in a Spider.  The area behind the seats is basically
> an open box section and could collapse under the weight of the car if
> the Spider is in "inverted flight", so to speak.  For that reason, the
> areas *under* the bar's vertical mounting points need to be reinforced.
> If I recall from Russ' article, he used iron pipe as anti-compression
> tubes around the relatively long bolts that would go through the inside
> area behind the seats down through to the underside of the car. Russ
> does have the advantage of having a welder and knowing how to use it.
> Alan Ward suggested cutting a slot in both the lower and upper sides of
> the box section and welding a piece of sheet steel in the slot and then
> cutting off and grinding the edges flush on the top and the bottom.
> Note that the box section is NOT quite square so you do have to pay
> attention to the angles so that the bolts are straight and not cocked.
> In my case, the shop drilled 1" holes through the box section (watch out
> for the battery cable!) and then made a jig to weld the tubes to the
> bottom backing plate at the correct angle, welded the tubes to the
> plate, then welded the tubes and plate into the car and then ground the
> tops of the tubes flush with the top of the box section.  Finally, so I
> wouldn't have to get under the car, they welded "weld nuts" to the
> bottom of the plate so I could put the bar in without having the get
> under the car.  Just drop the bolts in from the top and tighten, being
> careful not to strip them.  The backing plates for the rear 2 mounting
> points also had weld nuts installed so that I could do the install from
> the top, so to speak. It takes about 15 minutes to get the bar into the
> car and bolted down (longer if I'm in a hurry!).  The whole shop bill
> was about $300.  On some Spiders, you need to be careful about the brain
> box behind the seats but on mine it just fit without having to move
> anything but it's cozy.  There is some variation in Spider dimensions so
> you should definitely check and double check the fitment -- it would be
> much easier to get my bar in if the shop had moved the bar's mounting
> about 1/8" to the left.  You will not be able to close the top if the
> padding is on the bar (at least on mine -- Russ' may be different) and
> there's no way I'd drive around without the bar padding.
>
> I use an Autopower race bar.  One thing you should know is that the
> diagonal cross brace can interfere with the passenger seat belt if you
> don't pay attention to the belt when putting the bar in.  (AMHIK)  I
> really would rather have had a custom bar made so that it could be even
> higher, but I got the bar for a very good price.  If I have one made,
> the only thing that'll have to be changed is to move the rear mounting
> pads up so that the rear braces will be at the correct angle.   I have a
> rack to carry it either on my trunk or off my trailer hitch so that it
> doesn't have to stay installed on my way to the track.  Other things I
> would think about -- the package shelf is pretty flimsy stuff and
> doesn't take to being removed and put back all that often.  I made a new
> one out of birch plywood and hinged it in the middle so it's easier to
> get in and out.  If you have a Bosch Spider, I would also make a rain
> cover for the brain box out of a plastic box since it has been known to
> rain at the track and getting the brain box wet is likely not good for
> it.
>
> Bill Bain
> AROC Atlanta
> '83 Spider -- Roebling bound if it ever gets warm enough to work on the
> car!
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