Re: Alfa and Ferrari

[George Graves <gmgraves@domain.elided>]

You are right. Without Fiat, Alfa would have fizzled long ago. Alfa 
went through it's period of moibundity in the late eighties and early 
nineties. The GTV-6 was dropped instead of replaced. The Milano (75) 
Saloon, while a good handling car and a good performer (in it's  
3-liter form, anyway), was, well, shall we be charitable and say 
quirky-looking (Don't get me wrong, I love the car myself, but it is an 
"acquired taste")? In the USA in the early 'nineties Alfa sold two 
models: the 164 and the ubiquitous Spider. I have heard 
dyed-in-the-wool Alfisti muse that it was difficult to justify buying 
another Spider, which is the same as the last one and the one before 
it. The 164, while a pretty and a very nice sedan had limited appeal. 
The then-new Mazda Miata (M5) ate Alfa's lunch in the roadster 
category, and Alfa had nothing else to sell. The lack of compelling 
products killed them in North America. If the current Spider and GTV 
coupe had been introduced just a couple of years earlier, I dare say 
that Alfas would still be sold here in the USA. Under Fiat's wing, Alfa 
had a chance to re-invent itself and to sell the marvelous range of 
appealing products that it now offers. I have said this many times, if 
Alfa were still sold in the USA, both Pomigliano d'Arco and Arese would 
be working to capacity (and maybe even borrowing capacity from other 
Fiat plants such as Mirafioroi) filling US orders for 156s and 147's ON 
LOOKS ALONE. And I can tell you that the 156 Estate Wagon would be one 
of the top selling European Imports in the country, I'd almost bet 
money on it. I have always thought that Fiat was just a bit too 
trigger-happy on pulling out of this market. They should have waited a 
year or two and seen how the New Spider (which was introduced just as 
Fiat was folding Alfa's tent here) would sell. They failed because they 
had no products, they withdrew just as the floodgates for compelling 
new products (just what they needed) were about to open. Didn't make 
any sense in 1995 (I was waiting for the new Spiders. I had seen the 
pictures of the car from the one of the car shows, and was assured by 
my local dealer that they were on their way), doesn't make sense now.

OTOH, I see Fiat as being where Alfa was in the late '80's. A moribund 
automaker with few compelling products even for its own home market. 
The problem is that Fiat doesn't have a bigger Fiat to shelter them 
while they regroup. All they have is General Motors. And while Fiat's 
patronage of Alfa during its tough years was a GOOD THING, GM's 
takeover of Fiat (were that to happen) would certainly mean the end of 
Fiat as we know it, and possibly Alfa Romeo as well. Just my opinion, 
you understand.

George Graves
'86 GTV-6




On Sunday, Dec 8, 2002, at 10:17 US/Pacific, alfa-digest wrote:


> Date: Sat, 7 Dec 2002 21:35:10 -0000
> From: "Tim Hancock" <timhancock@domain.elided>
> Subject: Re: Alfa and Ferrari
>
> Graham Arlen's comments echo what I've been saying for some time. 
> Whilst Alfa
> and Maserati have re-found their niches, and Ferrari never really lost 
> its
> niche, FIAT have lost the plot and it may be too late for them. My 
> wife learnt
> to drive in a FIAT 128 1100 and her father had three 131s then a 
> Lancia Thema.
> My mum had a FIAT 128 1300 which was a great little car. We should be a
> natural FIAT customer, but since 1990 my wife has had
> four......Skodas......How come?
>
> The answer is.....QUALITY QUALITY QUALITY, and value for money, and 
> they have
> better suspension and steering and ride/handling/feel than the
> Japanese/Korean/Malaysian offerings. FIAT need to forget fancy 
> electronic
> gismos and get back to the basics of producing a good looking, good 
> handling,
> good value, and most importantly outstanding quality family car. They 
> need to
> recruit a few German and Japanese production engineers to achieve 
> this. Heresy
> it may be, but its also the truth. I fear the FIAT beaureacracy will 
> prevent
> this ever happening. When even the Italians have lost faith in FIAT 
> cars you
> need to think the unthinkable.
>
> What frightened me most this week was seeing a Daewoo I liked the look
> of...then I noticed the body shell is a Pininfarina design.Nuf said. 
> Alfa is
> doing too well now to kill off, but exactly who will own the brand in 
> five
> years time is a question I can't even begin to guess at.  Bit 
> depressing
> really as I am a FIAT fan deep down, and after all is said and done, 
> without
> FIAT, Alfa may have fizzled out years ago
>
>
> Tim Hancock   Boston UK
>
> 164TS
> 164 Super
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