FW: More on brakes and rotors

["Ev Micou" <mdg36@domain.elided>]

-----Original Message-----
From: Ev Micou [mailto:mdg36@domain.elided]
Sent: Monday, April 08, 2002 11:31 AM
To: Derek Ealy
Subject: RE: More on brakes and rotors


 I thought this thread had to do with brake rotor drilling/slots/resultant
surface area and the efficacy of the rotor -friction surface relationship.
Let's solve that issue first before introducing the added variable of the
force applied to the braking components themselves by the hydraulics! Great
braking cars have large swept areas....all other things being equal, swept
area is the great equalizer. my view
  -----Original Message-----
  From: Derek Ealy [mailto:dealy663@domain.elided]
  Sent: Monday, April 08, 2002 10:37 AM
  To: mdg36@domain.elided
  Subject: RE: More on brakes and rotors


  I am serious. I suppose I should have been a little more explicity in
stating that I meant on normal sized brakes for cars, not expecting that a
2" diameter brake is in the same league as a 10" one. I still put forth that
immediate braking force has more to do with the size of the master/slave
cylinders and coefficients of friction than a 10% difference in disk surface
area that might be accounted for by holes or slots.


  That said a 10% larger brake will still work better because it can
dissipate heat faster which is really what braking is all about.


  Derek

  ----Original Message Follows----
  From: "Ev Micou"
  To: "Derek Ealy"
  CC:
  Subject: RE: More on brakes and rotors
  Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 10:28:49 -0700
  you can't be serious--swept area has everything to do with braking force.
  theoretically, any brake can cause wheel lockup depending on the size of
the
  tire patch....
  respectfully, ev
  -----Original Message-----
  From: owner-alfa@domain.elided [mailto:owner-alfa@domain.elided]On Behalf Of
  Derek Ealy
  Sent: Monday, April 08, 2002 9:54 AM
  To: alfa-digest@domain.elided
  Subject: More on brakes and rotors
  In my opinion swept area does not really have that much to do with
  braking force generated. For instance on a car with small disk brakes,
  you can still lock up the tires quite readily. There isn't a car on the
  road in normal working condition that cannot lock up their wheels
  regardless of the size of the braking surfaces, or whether they are
  drums, solid disks, vented, drilled, slotted ( or grooved, gee yea I had
  some of those on my jeep but then my mechanic said the rotors were old
  and replaced them, he musta ripped me off!).
  The issue with the smaller swept areas are that they don't allow for
  repeated applications of heavy braking because they cannot dissipate the
  heat fast enough. If the brakes are already beyond the temperature which
  they can effectively accept the next energy transfer from the cars motion
  then the car will not slow down as well.
  What swept area has everything to do with is the ability to dissipate
  heat, and also just as importantly, effect modulation. The ability to
  generate braking force in a fine enough application to get maximal energy
  transfer without stepping over the line and locking up the wheel.
  Now I wonder if I post this message 5 or 6 times with the same wording,
  I'll be able to convince myself that everyone believes me.
  Derek
  ==================================
  Date: Mon, 8 Apr 2002 10:22:53 EDT
  From: AKress1948@domain.elided
  Subject: Re: brian's grooved rotors, bob wilkinson
  brian, my disks get that effect all by themselves!! Just run 'em and run
  'em,
  pretty soon they get nice grooves!! here i thought i was just cheap,
  now it
  looks like i've got the inate magic touch for high performance - like an
  idiot savant - or at least part of that!
  in a similar vein, can bob re-explain, "like slooowly" his lecture on
  first,
  second, and third order stuff?? intuitvely, one would think that swept
  area
  would have a significant impact on brake performance. same for tires for
  traction. otherwise we'd still be on 155/15s, and running little tiny
  disks.
  thanks,
  Andy
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