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Re: piston ovality on AD



John Fielding wrote:

Hi Jon,

I just read your comments on the AD about piston and liner ovality.

One thing.. when you get in there, try to measure the roundness and
taper of the cylinders and pistons if you can.. I am told that they tend
to wear oval, and if that's the case (beyond a small amount) you should
just get new pistons/liners.  Same if there is too much ridge at the
top, that won't hone out.. can cause those rings to go sooner than they
would have.
You might like to know that pistons are made oval, yes that's right they are
manufacturered to be oval in shape and tapered from top to bottom. The crown of the piston
is a little smaller than the bottom as it heats up more on the crown than the bottom
(skirt).  Consequently when the piston is at operating temperature it grows to fit the
liner, before that you often hear "piston-slap" on a new engine as the clearance is too
large with a cold engine.

In fact the ovality can be quite big.  The reason is that when the piston heats up in
operation the piston grows in size and fits the bore better. If you don't believe me go
and look at a piston manufacturers website to get the details.  It isn't a lot but enough
to be measurable on a new piston.

Moral of the story?  Hone those bores at your own risk!

John
Durban
South Africa
Alfetta 1.8L turbo

Yep, I was aware of the piston "ovality".. the pistons expand differently, due to a lot of metal thru the piston pin axis, and not as much 90 deg opposed.. as well as that taper. I should have mentioned that. The ovality (hmmm is this a word?) is designed so that when the engine is hot, the piston ends up more or less round.

For Maurice:

Just checking in some tech books I have, we're talking .0004" limit for oval and taper on the liner, and .0016 - .0023" for piston/liner clearance.. (both the 2L Spider Overhaul Manual PA8777, '90, and the 2000 tech and inspection characteristics book, '71, agree here) I couldn't find anything specific on the cold piston oval tolerances. So not a lot of leeway here..

From what I've heard and read (I'm not an expert here!) is often when reusing a liner the wear is close to too much, then more honing takes place to round things again, or is needed to remove a ridge.. and you end up with a piston that has even more clearance.. the rings don't seal, it drinks oil, wears early to the point that your compression goes down hill.. and you're back to where you needed to tear it down in the first place far sooner than you might have been...

Unless the liners are pretty well in tolerance, and need nothing but a light rehone for a good surface.. it's probably false economy to not replace them with a piston and liner set. The pistons wearing their ovalness away is probably much more likely ( and less easy to check?) then you have round pistons going oval when hot, and not doing well, so unless things are pretty good all around.. replacing everything with a new set is a very good idea considering all the work of getting in there..

Hope it helps..

Jon and Marcia
77 Spider
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