Linguistic glitches with the Alfasud interpretations and all that

[JHertzman@xxxxxxx]

In AD7-232 Carl Prochilo posted a translation (for those of us with little if
any reading knowledge of Italian) of a reply which Joe Iragiuele had posted to
something I had written on Alfa Romeo-Milano and the Alfasud. I responded in
AD7-234 with a note on the time-line of the government control of Alfa (in the
twenties) to the Alfasud project as part of the industrialization the south
(in the seventies). Joe Iragiuele responded in AD7-235. I can follow some
book-Italian with help from a dictionary, and some with help from a computer
translation program, but either I am getting slower (likely) or this was more
contemporary/informal usage than I was used to, and I wrote Prochilo about my
problem. He replied:

"Gee, I feel like Giuseppe's personal translator here.  I'm a bit rusty with
my Italian, but the subject is of interest to me and hence my effort on the
translation.  If you feel like posting, help yourself.  It's public domain as
far as I'm concerned."

> Date: Sat, 7 Nov 1998 07:45:20 EST
> From: IRAGIUELE@domain.elided
> Subject: Re: alfa-digest V7 #234
>
> In a message dated 98-11-06 23:39:27 EST, you write:
>
> << I'll leave it at that. Read on elsewhere, if so inclined, and sort out
your
>  own interpretations.
>
>  John H.  >>
> QUARDA CHE L`INTERPRETAZIONI NON SONO MOLTE TU VIVEVI IN ITALIA NEL 70 -- 72
> ???? PENSO DI NO  SERVIVANO POSTI DI LAVORO E TANTI
> FORSE PIU` DI ADESSO    L`EMIGRAZIONE  DAL  SUD  AL NORD  ERA SPIETATA   IL
> GOVERNO DOVEVA FARE QUALCOSA E SUBITO  PER IL MEZZOGIORNO ( E` IL TERMINE
CHE
> USANO PER  IL SUD ITALIA )
> IL FATTO STA.
>  E` STATA  UNA SCELTA FATTA DAI POLITICI  E CONDIVISA DA TUTTI I CITTADINI
O
> LA MAGGIOR PARTE DI ESSI
> 50 ANNI  NON PENSO CHE VI SIANO 50 ANNI DI DIFFERENZA DATO CHE SI PARLAVA DI
> ALFA SUD  E DEL NOME  CHE E` STATO TOLTO
> SE PENSI CHE NON ABBIA AVUTO A CHE FARE CON LA POLITICA  E I FONDI
> DEL GOVERNO ALL`ORA  E` UN ALTRO DISCORSO
> ALL`ORA HAI RAGIONE CI SONO 50 ANNI DI DIFFERENZA DALLA MIA SPIEGAZIONE
> UN NODO FISSO ALLA CESSIONE DELL` ALFA ALLA FIAT INVECE DELLA FORD FU COSA
> FARE A POMIGLIANO D`ARCO ED IL PROGETTO PROPOSTO DALLA FIAT FU IL MIGLIORE
DAL
> PUNTO DI VISTA SOCIALE
> NOTO SOCIALE IN 6 MESI ERANO GIA IN ATTIVO A POMIGLIANO SENZA GRANDI PERDITE
> DI POSTI DI LAVORO AL SUD
> ADESSO TAGLIO SE NO ANDIAMO A FINIRE CHE QUALCUNO DICE  CHE
> ERA MEGLIO CHE L`ALFA FOSSE STATA AQUISTATA DALLA FORD
> NOTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTTT
> PER L`ALFA IL MATRIMOGNIO MIGLIORE CHE POTEVA AVERE  LO HA AVUTO CON LA
> F.I.A.T. ( GRAZIE  AGNELLI ) E 100 ANNI ANCORA DI F.I.A.T
> MA SOPRA TUTTO  CONTROLLATA DALLA FAMIGLIA AGNELLI
> UPS........ SE NON SBAGLIO UNICA CASA DI AUTO AL MONDO  CON UNA FAMIGLIA
COME
> MAGGIORE AZZIONISTA ASSOLUTO
>
> SPERO DI NON AVER OFFESO NESSUNO  SE HO OFFESO QUALCUNO  SPERO CHE ACCETTI
LE
> MIE SCUSE
> CIAOOOOOOO A TUTTI  DA  JOE
>
"Look, there aren't that many interpretations here.  Did you live in Italy
from 1970 to 1972?  I don't think so.  There was much need for employment,
more so then than now.  Emigration from the south to the north was quickening.
The government had to act quickly on behalf of the mezzogriorno (a demarcation
that marks the official beginning of the southern italian peninsula, just
south or Rome; the Mason-Dixon line of Italy if you will).  The fact stands.
It was a decision made by the politicians with support from the citizens, at
least the majority of them.  50 years?  I don't think there was a difference
of 50 years given that we're talking of Alfa Sud and the name from which it
came.  If you don't think the decision had to do with politics and government
funding, then that's another discussion.  Okay, you're right that there were
50 years of difference with respect to my explanation.  A given on the sale of
Alfa to Fiat instead of Ford had to do with Pomigniano D'Arco, and the project
proposed by Fiat was the best choice from a social perspective. Note, in six
months of activity at Pomigliano there were not many lost jobs in the south.
Now I better cut and run before someone suggests that Alfa would have been
better off being taken over by Ford.  NOT! 
For Alfa, the marriage made in heaven was in fact done with FIAT (Thanks
Agnelli), and another 100 years to FIAT, but more importantly under the
Agnelli's control (BTW, it was sad to read about the passing of Gianni's son
recently).  If I'm not mistaken, FIAT is the only majority owned major
automotive manufacturer in the world.
I hope I haven't offended anyone, but if I have, please accept my apologies."
====================================================

I don't disagree with anything Joe Iragiuele said here about the social and
economic and political factors involved in the decision to establish the
Alfasud production at Pomigniano D'Arco. I did mean to say that the deletion
of the "Milano" from the Alfa Romeo badge occurred in conjunction with the
Alfasud project, and not in conjunction with the much earlier assumption of
control by I.R.I., which was what I understood he was saying in his earlier
post. If there was any misunderstanding here, either by Joe about what I meant
or by Carl or me about what Joe replied, I certainly regret it and I hope he
will accept our good intentions.

Cordially, 

John H.

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